Dangers Within the Church- Red Cups, Red Flags, Church Splits and Foul Smelling Theology…

Tony wolf post

(reinstated Nov 16th 2016 after being deleted in some manner)

An analytical “gospel centered” response to an inconceivable claim…..in light of recent history..

(To better understand the “grade 3 level English”, a term I welcome and embrace, consider reading around the brackets first then the bracketed section after if you care to. My attempt with their use is/ was to bring more clarity to a particular situation or point out the irony of a matter. Hope that helps…)

A good way to determine Tony Walsh where the danger arises from “within the church” is to analyze only 3 amongst many important rarely discussed considerations or “observations”, being that I am not under any obligation whatsoever to corrupt confidentiality agreements within a body of faith that is apparently built on the foundation of the credibility of truth and truth telling. “True truth”- Francis Schaeffer:

1. Using the posted depicted imagery of a wolf or fox, begin by looking for what they feed on the most, in this case sheep, via the love of honor and its subsequent positions of respect but primarily the love of money without fiduciary accountability. So be sure to actively and carefully follow the money while scripture is often engineered and twisted in attempts to implore you to show me the money because rarely if ever is it specifically and transparently divulged as in our experience. Check..

I won’t get into the relatively astronomical numbers I’m aware of considering the return on “investment in the kingdom of God” but rather do some homework and don’t forget to consider the “Clergy Residence Deduction” benefit amounts on top of what is reported below if my research, gathered information and data are correct.

Special Rules for Clergy   or   Guide to Clergy Resident deduction

It’s for these reasons that Canada requires the public availability and reporting of general fiscal spending within non profit societies and organizations to detect general expenditure trends for the purpose of further inquiry by those that as a result choose to donate, donate “generously” or not donate at all, which by the way is NOT giving to God as often manipulatively “taught”, simply look at the numbers for yourself. Request detailed Balance sheets to determine the level of openness and the percentage of salary being drawn per individual compared to revenue. As you trust them with your hard earned God given provision meant for your sustenance, they should, as a public “non profit” entity, trust and expect to have their fiscal books reviewed by ANY responsible contributing stakeholder modelled in the scripture or society whether it be the widow inquiring about the mite she contributed or the generous giver or even the religious zealot contributors who love to be seen or affirmed or given a place of importance for their exorbitant contribution (when in essence it’s far less than the marginalized or dismissed widows mite and many others as Jesus points out), and the proportion of openness or reluctance will be the same proportion of safety or danger to you or I respectively, the real and living and breathing church, to weigh and consider.

Redemption Hill Church– a key observation is to note the compensation to tax receipted percentage ratio year to year in this business venture.  Of which the first year or two was funded through a series of manipulative steps in obtaining cash through secret “confidential agreements”  with Crossway “leadership”  and “supporters” without the full awareness or consent of those who “sacrificially” donated and are key stakeholders outside their strategically corrupt coup.

2012 (inceptional reporting period of Redemption Hill “Church Plant” and note the movements and allegiances of Directors year to year)

2013 – Directors (almost all Directors conveniently resign despite some of them being responsible for the “legal counsel” to draft deceptive nondisclosure agreements leaving a sense of bewildered betrayal…… again. A familiar pattern.)

2014 – Directors  (The replacement)

2015 – Directors (Now defunct and Tony Walsh leaves town for a position in Westminster CO Grace Community Church still affiliated to the near morally bankrupt Sovereign Grace Ministries conveniently renamed and reinvented as Sovereign Grace Churches, of which it didn’t take very long for him to be “given”-only insiders would know the truth but may never speak- the role of lead pastor through likely “humble exemplary” leadership and character as modeled with the trail of destruction, empty pockets and benevolent dictatorship trauma he left behind in Langley BC)
***** Tony Walsh we eagerly await what beautiful “forthcoming bio”  narrative that will be presented for all to discover, elaborating on how you often end up on top as the top dog or “lead pastor” (and curiously & “coincidentally” top compensation) of every church employment endeavour you take on no matter how “humble” an entry you made as an “exemplary servant leader”. The preceding two “quotations” surround issues or topics you’ve often taught on that several hundred people, not to mention your last church scheme you escaped from here in Canada, would definitely have issue with your qualifications in “teaching” such matters. Much like CJ Mahaney and his delusional attempt in actually penning and publishing a book on and titled “Humility” for his kingdom followers to learn and study from…. *****

Here is the Donate2charities overall graph view of Redemption Hill Church.

(April 2017 donate2charities.ca is now apparently offline and for the time being no longer accessible possibly to the cheers of some nonprofits)  

Historical graph view of Crossway Community Church.

Or view the Crossway Community Church CRA submission history directly here. Unfortunately because of online record keeping availability one can’t view the fiscal activities of these men beyond 2011 without requesting them from CRA. A step that can easily be taken. And it’s not to difficult to read the tea leaves through the ongoing diminishing revenue and turmoil of leadership change since the unsanctioned secretive in essence “no fault” coup of 2011.

As already mentioned be sure to compare this pastors ratio of compensation versus tax receipted donations with other non profit societies, church or not, to determine what fiscal health looks like remembering (according to accountants) that continued and/ or significant revenue declines are a sign of things happening below the surface and behind the scenes of smiling faces, the latest contemporary church and discipleship programs fraught with and fueled by self satisfying works based religious obligations, and hipster unapologetic high decibel worship bands. Additional questions amongst many still on record and documented as unanswered that were cleverly short circuited with confidentiality agreements to be aware of are the procurement of assets meant for the operation of the organization (paid for by you and I) possibly being overturned, lent and/ or used by relevant staff/ vocational elder directors or volunteer beneficiaries for other more serious or lucrative profitable ventures or purposes possibly without proper permissions, vetting, purchase or rental agreements to reimburse the nonprofit entity comprising of our contributions.

2. Look for a scattering of sheep from a central location such as Crossway Church or Redemption Hill (now defunct with Tony Walsh fleeing Canada to Denver’s SGM based Grace Community Church)  or similar such places where such “dangers” exist , followed by either spiritually dying or dead disillusioned sheep at worst or liberated free churched or dechurched “sovereignly” enlightened sheep at best many often struggling with the mental health challenges arising from the ironic mental health dichotomy of having to accept the lies and hypocrisy (as if the challenges in our own lives aren’t enough) before them or contend with threats of needing to be “adjusted” erroneously and “sovereignly” emailed to the wrong party originally meant for pastors who were to carry out the “adjustment”. Check..

Be wary of angry threats of being excommunicated and publicly humiliated (see earlier post account and to be expected here too) as with the case of an inquiring former member {made out to be mentally unstable by offensively aggressive/ bullying men who could not connect the dots nor counsel themselves out of a wet paper bag and then smugly mocked on Facebook by other idiotically insensitive toxic members (and screen captured by many) for the same individual having to face the lesser “grace motivated” punishment of “church discipline”, a crock indeed} and your former unaccountable colleagues upon you being ousted at Crossway as “A Church Plant in Langley” while it’s generally reported that you “left” (ran, fled). Check..

3. And primarily look for the convenient departing of initially zealous key right hand players and key legal non profit societal directors within the new venture, Redemption Hill Church, not only from their roles but your specific new church plant altogether especially if it happens all at once in one planned event (planned to them or at very least curiously timed, yet unexpected by you and your bewildered surrogate director DM and many others) along with their wives. Six individuals and their families gone in almost one day which was just the beginning. Check..

Reasons for such departing yet undisclosed and a typical church MO guarded secret for unsuspecting visitors to never be aware of (yet lately an openly discussed smell test mess), yet one simply has to follow the links and do the math (provided the reporting is accurate) in point 1 to understand what would likely be unacceptable in the real world yet acceptable in the “grace filled” church of Christ considering on whose backs such opulent, entitled, unaudited, undisclosed income is built on going back to recent Crossway Church history. All of you doing God only knows what along with all important historic SGM “Conference hopping” all over North America especially when the numbers of parishioners and contributing members are (were) quite low at “The Plant” .

On a final note having attempted to communicate privately and recently on the matter of fiscal responsibility or accountability historically and currently with you to no avail or response whatsoever on the specific subject other than an evasive “sorry that you are still ‘hurt’, let’s do coffee”, covered in another one of your recent absurd “hurt” posts I simply present this rebuttal to such a ridiculous Facebook post as this to bring some clarity to the real dangers. But one can always count on the “Gospel Coalition” via Mr Deyoung, Tim Challies and many others to provide ample religious supply of materials for cannon fodder for all types of religious “leaders” and “religious addicts” the likes of Tony, Pat, Fred and David Smith , with all types of unknown backgrounds and motivations, the tools, articles and quotable quotes upon which to stand on their shoulders and use “their” “approved” verbiage and group speak as your own and as a defensive front for unchallengable (sp) “vetted” truth that comes from on high with rarely a single original thought, contribution, comment, critique and more importantly wise consideration remembering front whence we came.

To summarize, those are where the real dangers to watch for lie “within the church” institution in today’s world and church or religious cultures and arenas. So as with the much talked about and much ado about nothing regarding the red Starbucks Merry Christmas cups let’s not equate the serious matters of “the greatest dangers to the church…comes from within” as something equally lite and fool-hearty that one can just post up and move onto other subjects as though such statements aren’t loaded with religious rhetoric, falsehoods, missed steps, misleadings and undertones as though the dangers aren’t directly related to or are in some way outside of you and your cohort leaders, backers and “friends”/ elders. A cancerous conflict of interest condition that plagues much of the modern organized church that more and more genuine Christian/ believers are extricating themselves from as that institution becomes more irrelevant, redundant and most importantly toxically self serving unable to self adjudicate rightly on internal matters of serious breaches for the benefit of the people rather than self interest or preservation, despite several clear biblical reasoned opposition mandates and processes to the contrary. What many are now seeing is a Father loving His people and children by freeing them almost as though through a second deliverance, after ones initial salvation, from the shackles of codependent religious addiction, while He gathers them of like mind and heart to one another outside of the weighty and syphoning religious obligations of “church life” that eventually falls apart as many know and experience the “burn out” of “serving” and performing in the “local church” provided they’re not fuelled by the love of growing capacity and self importance within the system, which in itself should be revealing within ones own soul but rarely is. Within this growing liberated and free environment we find where true elders, teachers, pastors and the like who happen to exhibit and demonstrate such actual selfless gifts while existing and holding down jobs in the highways and byways of the real world like the rest of us whether white collar or blue collar, professional or tradesman (tradespeople) thinking nothing of their roles or impassioned giftings that sweetly supplement their vocation, I’ve met a few. Very much like what is so often preached and described of Jesus himself, who came and dwelt among us making NOTHING of the fact of who He was. Quite antithetical to todays church leaders.

What have we done to His actual church (those of deep faith worldwide He calls His children in the Bible) but often turned it/ them into a den of smooth alpha type psychologically selected lions (unlike Aslan either, he would be/ is severely mortified and angered) within a taxed, user fee “covenant members responsibilities” circus show, all the while Jesus stands backstage outside the tent waiting for those (in varying degrees of disillusionment, brokenness, enlightened understanding and disbelief mind you) who quietly eventually find their way out or are almost forcefully and coercively shown the way out. Only to discover where Jesus Himself often really is, standing and patiently waiting to embrace them outside what is so often todays degenerating dog and pony show misrepresented as His church.

Having recently come across this it’s no wonder individuals like Lecrae shake up the religious status quo with sharp lyrics that are pretty much bang on with how the outside world and most likely Jesus Himself views most (not all) of todays church systems in his tune “Church Clothes” from a couple of years back. And it would appear that is a growing sentiment. But lest we “pat” ourselves on the back, that view isn’t the one often preached as some sort of congratulatory persecution but rather justified criticism of the hypocrisy wilfully carried out and ignored by many who lead todays churches surrounding themselves with people who crave and love self importance more than the people they “serve”.

Ezekiel 34, Act 20: 29-30

Many are hoping and praying that your association as apparent pastors with other ministries, people and outsiders (beyond the familiar singular ulterior noble motive of evangelizing potential dependent obedient subjects of “Jesus” and potential paying customers, see point 1, rather than knowing, respecting and establishing connections with people that the dignity of Imago Dei deserves and demands) will bring you and your colleagues the much needed insight into what a “minister” or “ministry” is meant to be about and for.

minister
Verb:
9. to give service, care, or aid; attend, as to wants or necessities.:
to minister to the needs of the hungry.
10. to contribute, as to comfort or happiness.

Ministry as defined biblically is a reciprocal gift we freely give to one another by the leading of the spirit of Christ within the heart and mind unencumbered and without entanglement. A gift of love, caring and sacrifice amidst those we encounter in life AS we TRUST GOD and EARN a livelihood respectfully by normal “secular” (come to not like that demeaning and misleading almost self righteous term often used in christendom) means, as Paul’s clear example. Not paying to garner for status, respect, tax receipts or political placement within the institutional church and not paying for buildings and often (yet not always) unjustifiable, if we were honest about the pragmatic job description and/ or actual function, management salaries like those displayed above.

Matthew 10: 5-8
And as you go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers, cast out demons. FREELY you RECEIVED , FREELY GIVE….. (THAT is the much talked about yet often elusive authentic “Gospel”, as we see the needs and have the means to quietly fulfill them without tax receipts, obligation or guilt induced motivation NOR personal and religious institutional fanfare…. “as they shared everything in common” laterally and literally.)

As always “The best defense against the bulls–t is vigilance. So if you smell something, say something.” Jon Stewart Final Show.

(Acts 17:11)

Because the well being of others could be depending on you to act and call autonomous leaders (ironically surrounded by boards at times) to account as we are all similarly called to account, “in the real world” not this kind of sloppy “grace filled” convenient world of church life oozing with reproachable toxic faith. Bottom line, it’s a complete fallacy that such social media claims such as this Facebook post and many others like them would ever be proposed to be taken seriously by any of these once “cadre” of particular pastors at all. Beware… and once again use careful discernment or give to more deserving nonprofit organizations or hold on to your cash and don’t buy the false guilt induced judgement and nonsense that your “checkbook reveals your heart” (still being “preached” in at least one of these churches often by “guest speakers” in the hopes of making it more palatable) from any of their new church endeavours unless it is equally matched with the fact that opening up their complete salaries for scrutiny also reveals their heart as to whether they are authentic shepherds or mere hirelings. The very fact that it would likely be inconceivable and unwelcomed so also should the nonsense of a checkbook revealing ones heart be equally challenged and or biblically shredded along with its corrupt logic and intent no matter who is preaching in that pulpit. The sermons specific to these types of activities and manipulative behaviour are readily available and easily detected if you listen intently as Jon Stewart notes above.

Once again just watch, wait, observe, and compare, it may be 1 year or 5 years, the same MO will eventually surface again in these types of men, until they themselves seek professional help, and YOU may be their next target if you dare challenge their unseen intent, motivation or fiscal practice. Many of todays’ churches are faced with the same dilemma, the illusion of gospel “success” at any cost even if it means you, the “disloyal”, the “naysayers”, compared as Joshuas’ “jerks” who came back with a “bad report” and those who dare think critically end up as collateral damage for the sake of the gospel/ church and its preservation at any cost. In other words the outspoken Sanballats and Tobias’ of the infamous Nehemiah series that started these men on their way (although the seeds of collusive discontent where possibly planted months if not years before and in the making and fuelled by the ambitious young intern as disclosed evidence suggests) , a text and Bible reference that in no way relates or applies to their actions and rebuilding endeavours or justification. These are practices that are more akin to the modern capitalist North American business model and looks and acts NOTHING like the church described in the New Testament from which they “preach” and “teach”. Todays’ church is often an irreparably broken system of man made ideals masquerading as half truths as they preach 1. the utter depravity of all with our only hope being Christ (half truth for the Christian and even more so for those who subscribe to ultra religious fundamentalism) along side 2. the sinfulness of judging the motive of ones heart namely theirs, (another half truth ) and 3. a doctrine of obedience and submission to authority, all which end up being an unbiblical yet convenient (for its beneficiaries, those at the top of the fiscal pyramid and those who seem to love their role and or status as favoured supporters) toxic mix of dangerous ideologies and doctrines laced with half truths fed to its’ members and those “submitted” and “obedient” to these types of narcissistic personalities resulting in being hamstrung and labelled as “miserable Christians” if one dares speaks against them or challenges their motives. A sad double standard eventually surfaces in such leaders who freely label the challenges of others who are outspoken as mentally unstable and “miserable Christians” but gives himself the liberty and license to describe his own internal angst as an (suspiciously exploitive) appeal of a sympathetic struggle with depression as though his diagnosis of others isn’t also as a result of depression symptomatic of the outcome of his and others actions of authoritarian abuses or manipulative “teaching”. With an inability to connect such critical dots between spiritual truth, spiritual abuses and its resultant psychological and mental health affects (often still denied as unbiblical psychobabble thereby doing and causing more harm) because of uneducated, strategically wilful biases and or ignorance such men should not be considered as fit for counselling His precious people let alone anyone until they find professional introspective help and direction themselves. Because the Bible is chocked full of not only spiritual truth but psychological insight into the care of souls and harms that can be done. I have no professional degree in anything yet it is blaringly clear to me that those connections are present in abundance and must be made and acknowledged to truly care for people.

I do believe there are truly great pastors out there but in this day and age of greed and a growing culture of entitlement and kingdom building they are truly few and far between because they either work amongst us as “secular” coworkers or, if as salaried pastors, rarely if ever clamour for the notoriety of standing out in faithless modern day social media campaigns to attend “our church” for many other less than noble reasons.

So one must be vigilant and on guard for ones own well being and the well being of your family particularly our children in these environments if you choose to continue to remain where the hireling may often be made up or fashioned and disguised to be a shepherd.

*****
To the growing number of anonymous evangelical trolls and impersonators for Christ (likely from or related to one of these 3 spawned churches Redemption Hill- now defunct, The Bridge Church, Crossway Church-experiencing another change with the old guard) and the benefit of any others… I would beg and beseech you to consider the words and takeaways from this short yet unimaginably relevant (to us all) video clip shared earlier. Your future mental and spiritual health and well being of your family (and equally important your families finances) and the freedoms you should be enjoying in Christ intended for the believer may possibly be at stake in grasping and considering or being vigilant in watching for what is mentioned in these 9 minute videos.

BTW I won’t “Pat” myself on the back (as suggested by a troll) because he and his partners have been on mine and others backs for far too many years (buying into the mantra and rhetoric of “sacrificially giving” significant amounts with some families recently stating with low level frustration they “gave” to the tune of $50K over 3 years at one point and continued in trust) only to end up culminating in a well cloaked, questionable and unaccountable documented end that hopefully would net them a significant portion of the $600K or so yearly gross revenue as reported in the point 1 links. A dysfunctional outcome that inevitably had roots that go years back after missing several years of “Family” AGM meetings. Yet many of the cronies (my apology, enablers who conveniently took up new appointments and positions within the new regime) who gave them the license for such behaviour, less than arms length conflict of interest friends and family with some historically already and admittedly involved (with a chuckle in his voice at a restaurant and pleased with himself supposing God is pleased with such key, clever and special agent involvement in church splits, affairs/ issues yet often known to speak from the other side of his mouth with noble exemplary humility that “I’m just a dumb drywaller”) in other previous church splits locally, currently talk of battery acid in the soul after freely giving himself license in assisting with liberally pouring the same battery acid, to use similar analogy, on the eyes and souls of 300 or so people no water added. Sadly that’s ironically rich and typical of the problems with many churches today, above giving an account with no resignations or repentance or even a remorseful apology of any sort in sight, knowingly and wilfully throwing questioning people under the bus after such deception and destruction then stating or instructing from a FULLY compromised pulpit people are not to talk amongst themselves about this any more lest it “create division”. As though he were addressing his children. One of the multiple first orders of business after a well orchestrated draconian and unethical takeover, warranted or not, with strategically selected (unelected) “elders”/ directors or supporters was NOT to gather compassionate information of the psychological and spiritual state of people or ask if they felt (still being taught that we don’t go or live by our feelings, bizarre and once again convenient) this was an appropriate and respected action after such an unsolicited dictatorship event but rather to quietly (without full congregational membership awareness) strike up a new “research” committee comprising of favoured members to put forward and grant themselves an “approved” pay raise. Only in the church and politics could such strategically hurried paced shenanigans, taking advantage of confusion and bewilderment (the fog of war), go on utilizing thousands upon thousands of “sacrificially” donated funds without any kind of transparent or permitted journalistic questioning, proper investigation as to societal legal requirements, critique, or open oversight or review into their process especially as a “non profit” organization. But if WE can just say we can’t talk about this or answer direct questions it should all go away shortly and we can continue with business as usual under new gospel centered nonprofit business models, “Praise God”. And with that being just the tip of the iceberg no, it’s your turn now to “Pat” yourself on the back and carry that load…. and… well, we’ll leave it at that for now. What I will say is that their recent history that put them all in various apparently short lived power positions and long term biblical historical records in general has proven that certain brands of religious people/ leaders are far too clever for many of us who were encouraged to practice trust, obedience, submission and faithfulness. The Caiaphas types come to mind.

But honestly…..when it comes to influences this powerful such as religious addictions spoken of here that feel so gratifying and “right”, as one who has seen much of this (and was party to it for a brief period before resigning but not departing) over 28 years of varied “church life” experiences, ignorance is NOT bliss because as is accurately said the devil is often buried in the details, a fact you’ll never hear from many pulpits when it comes to preaching the whole truth about preserving livelihoods and reputations.

Part 1

Part 2

24 Responses to Dangers Within the Church- Red Cups, Red Flags, Church Splits and Foul Smelling Theology…

  1. Concerned and confused says:

    Get a life man. Things you could do instead of wasting your time writing this crap:
    -Read a book
    -Go for a walk
    -Plant a garden
    -Make a new friend
    -Learn to use a comma
    -Take up a hobby
    -Adopt a stray cat

    • Rory says:

      What’s your name ‘MAN’, although one might be able to make an “edumacated” guess? For someone who is confused, I’d think you would have more questions not a list of your daily routine? Anyways, writing, about, professional, Christians (and I’m not referring to vocational only) , like you possibly, IS my hobby and passion, buddy because somebody’s gotta talk about this buried s$#t lest it just continues with impunity while they’re surrounded by folks like yourself happy to do nothing.

  2. T-Man says:

    Thanks for sharing your incoherent and insane ramblings. You must be proud of yourself. You have accomplished so much with your life. Next thing on your list should be to finish high school so that you can go beyond your current grade 3 level of English.

    All the best to you in your quest of vitriol and bitterness. Enjoy

    • Rory says:

      Tony if this really is you (which I doubt, could be anyone, I know) either way whoever this is then trust me, I’d rather stick with my grade 3 level of English edumacation than be schooled in the grandest of religious institutions of higher edumacation or schooled in the art of living off the unaware, generous proceeds of others with the hopefully near defunct Sovereign Grace Pastors College or some so called Bible College as my claim of having a theological education to being an accomplished religious leader of today. Merely pointing to your degree of obvious masterererery of the english language and likely your theological prowess is predictable along with the base level hurling of childish insults really is no different than the religious leaders of centuries ago that didn’t and don’t fair to well in the New Testament. One would hope, as a teacher of Bible “truth” (which likely T-Man isn’t), you’d recall what Paul thought of all his many religious credentials (none of which you, whoever you are, possess), dung I say, nothing but dung.

      Those 3 among many other points of Dangers within the church are really relevant and things you should pay close attention to, trust me it has little to do with vitriol or bitterness the often go to distraction or red herring (unless you or someone you know are in the business of church or within the system and rely on the proceeds of others, then yes bitterness becomes your deflection or distraction and that’s all you see) but rather what to watch for in these toxic places of worship. These ramblings are simply a record for those who may mistakingly find themselves blindly walking into such religious institutions so many of which are really just whitewashed sepulchres that are either empty of Christ’ presence or full of varying degrees of rotting flesh and bones brought on by the ongoing lacerations of the law by its teachers and the shackles of the ironically pridefully deceptive “knowledge of God” often resulting in unhealthy codependent enslavement to its hearers as noted in various locations in the New Testament. But oh how we love our privileged roles and positions of respect and self importance in the church to the point of being conveniently powerless to turning over the tables of the money changers at and within its doors.

      You really ought to consider getting a real job like the rest of us or something like one rather than trying to manage people through the means of some sort of religious calling if that’s your current business T-Man, many (correction some) have said and continue to say is just not there with you and some of your former colleagues. Maybe insurance or real estate sales (just watch for the pitfalls of corruption there too) or even consider finance like that highly educated, self proclaimed peddler of wit Stephen character with the equally convincing accent (you may be able to clear 80 to 100k there if you’re willing to start at the bottom with a clear conscience) or something or maybe back into construction. Maybe even carpentry, apparently Jesus was a carpenter….and we all know how closely religious types like to “follow Jesus” to make his name known.

      Anyways it was equally fun “T-Man”. ;)

    • Rory says:

      Denial accompanied with religious addiction are powerful intoxicating drugs. Please keep or save your anonymously now spammed prayers to your well fashioned, ideological, indifferent , and perverse god to yourself and your family (who really need it at this time). We certainly don’t need that god here. He’s faithfully taking good care of us within the love, just, gracious and truthful character and means of who He says He is, and through the love, care, and prayers of seasoned faithful uncompromised people of like mind and understanding. People without their hands on or benefiting from the commercial industry of many churches that have and leave many hamstrung out of convenient blindness and or fear to a false gospel founded on cash flow needs, good works and religious practices in the public marketplace for all to see that they hope will “influence” the world rather than the model of genuine unseen unannounced sacrifice, service, love, respect and dignity Jesus gives all sinners, tax collectors, prostitutes, adulterers, manipulators, clever deceptive collusionists and “bitter vitriols” like me as He bids us all come and follow Me.

      BTW, everyone who has engaged here in the past knows who I am and identified themselves, who the hell are you (that sounds familiar doesn’t it) hiding behind falsehood and IP Spoofing or proxy accounts with an email account of some poor soul in Dublin Ireland? Ahh don’t bother answering that…it’s more of the typical Christian guerrilla tactics, amongst this particular “reformed” bunch, you all like to pull over peoples eyes with a smile on your face that got you all where you are today and Pat referenced at one time…. ;)

  3. Rory says:

    Latest pastoral or maybe trolling/impersonator spammed comment/ admonishment… possibly for daring to touch god’s anointed ones, who knows…

    “Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and you perish in the way, for his wrath is quickly kindled.”

    So, by whose hand will my perishing take place if one doesn’t “Kiss the Son” according to your “professional” and compromised (religiously addicted) assessment or will it be one of those manipulations of scripture to accommodate when something untoward befalls someone and becomes an excellent sermon example on “sovereignty” for your subjects to come to terms with the fearsome glory of your god (and your preaching and “anointing”) somewhat akin to the unveiling of the Wizard of Oz.

    Don’t pretend those perspectives aren’t out there amongst you,they are readily available.

    Anyways, you all, pastors and elders alike might want to consider some SERIOUS tweaking or maybe a complete overhaul of your various discipleship classes whether locally, in Denver or during extended sabbaticals…. because it doesn’t look like they’re going well nor possibly effective if the desperate incoming comments here are any indicator.

    It’s been suggested (backed and confirmed by psychological studies and real counselling experts) that pastors, elders and some members alike in these and possibly similar toxic environments take a minimum 6 month break (if not indefinitely) from all this religious activity and micro management to begin to see clearly (as many have claimed once removed, with their faith very much still intact and even strengthened for being out from self preserving assimilating group speak and environments that discourage free thought) the magnitude by which your religious addiction has taken over ones ability to reason and perceive the degree of sinful legalistic aggressive tactics and cover ups with just enough truth yet void of the “gospel centredness” you preach that you have been subjecting God’s children to for many years both from pulpits and back rooms and even living rooms. Some of you seem to be on that road already, I pray the time serves you well as we all pursue to walk more closely and genuinely with Christ with no murky compromising attachment that muddies the waters of who Jesus Christ really is, as Paul exemplified.

    A blunt and honest statement that may not fit the polished exterior of religious addicts…

    In this day and age of so many (obviously not all but the evidence is all over the news that you conveniently often like to label as gossip to your faithful followers) compromised churches flying below the radar many ARE finding joy kissing the Son when they begin with choosing to no longer kiss the asses of its “Christian” institutional leaders and accomplices in these types of all to common environments, amidst so called “sound doctrines” laced with dark practices, as with Jesus’ many examples of his scathing indictment of religious leaders such as Luke 12 actually preached from one of your very own pulpits somewhat recently. I’ll assist in jogging some memories:

    Beware of the Leaven of the Pharisees

    12 In the meantime, when so many thousands of the people had gathered together that they were trampling one another, he began to say to his disciples first, “Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy. 2 Nothing is covered up that will not be revealed, or hidden that will not be known (that includes me as well). 3 Therefore whatever you have said in the dark shall be heard in the light, and what you have whispered in private rooms shall be proclaimed on the housetops.

    4 “I tell you, my friends, do not fear those who kill the body, and after that have nothing more that they can do.
    [an encouraging text btw amidst claims of my perishing🙂 ]

    That’s where the real joy of uncompromised relationship with the Son and one another along with freedom, faith and hope through the mind for the heart begins to take deeper root, admittedly over time.

  4. Rory says:

    “Servant of Yahweh” (weird) you need to get out with your family while you still can with whatever reason and thought faculties you still have.

    This WILL help provided you are willing to wean yourself off codependent religious addictions and begin to allow the Holy Spirit (not needy men) to help you both think independently to find the heart of Jesus. Once again we are called to think as the Bereans did for good reason. I couldn’t be more serious.

    http://www.findingchurch.com/

    “What if there really is something more?”

  5. Rory says:

    Haha
    Not in the least T-man, not in the least bit. But keep the cowardly anonymity coming…however if you are local I’d be happy to meet with you at a Starbucks close by, you know, the place with the red cups you all were so courageously opposing and where genuine public marketplace discipleship is demonstrated. Otherwise consider Proverbs 26:17

    “He who, passing by, stops to meddle with strife that is none of his business is like one who takes a dog by the ears.”.

    You know where to find me to arrange it…if you’re local and know anything about Crossway’s history.

  6. Angelo says:

    You are a very confused and delusional fraud. How many have you led astray? For the sake of your soul I hope you repent and ask the forgiveness of all those you have slandered. You should be ashamed of yourself.

    • Rory says:

      If this is who you claim to be, I fully understand your position as a replacement director of the 3 earlier ones that washed their hands of the now defunct Redemption Hill and why you may feel the way you do toward my assertions. I’ve been labelled far worse by true religious addicts so I can’t help but take your commentary as a compliment.

      http://www.brentdetwiler.com/brentdetwilercom/long-story-by-washingtonian-magazine-about-cj-mahaney-covena.html

      On the topic of “leading astray” Angelo, this should be very interesting once released of the culture of deep control and whitewashing that was/ is often prevalent in these types of toxic “nonprofit church” environments…. but if you or anyone still have any part to do with any of the former SGM pastor/church splinters or plants or whatever the heck you want to call it flying below the radar in Langley or Vancouver BC (one of which now being defunct has skipped town and moved on to Denver back into Sovereign Grace Ministries / Churches while another on an extended sabbatical/ leave of absence possibly paid seems to be flooding the blogosphere with the “seasoned wisdom” and unoriginal ‘substantial similarity’ stories “Pioneers’ Pianos” , akin to a desperate political twenty something year old seeking office, on us easily impressed and enamoured religious audiences) please close your eyes and plug your ears at once and as once often and clearly instructed so as not to be contaminated with something so silly as the facts which for these “cadre” of pastors and their surrounding leaders is curiously often if not exclusively rooted in or defined as “gossip and slander”. Does one suppose nondisclosure confidentiality agreements were made just for kicks or the delusion (to use your terminology) of exemplary leadership? Come on people, sadly and unfortunately many of the Johnny come lately’s (even 2003 and beyond right up to the insertion of the “intern” strategist takeover prince of preachers) have no idea how deep their rabbit-holes go because you can be assured of this “You may be very sure men fall in private long before they fall in public”- J.C. Ryle. OK if Gospel Coalition blogger/ member quotes are all you folks will consider as worthy of an audience then please let’s consider the following inconvenient truth together by Carl Trueman:

      “I think of church leaders who simply became such objects of adulation by their people and by the wider evangelical world that, when they fell, (insertion- provided their fall wasn’t completely camouflaged by complicit enablers donning transparent blinders on themselves and everyone around who obeyed) it was clear that they had simply come to be regarded as too big to be held accountable. Nobody dared call them to account; nobody ever even suspected they needed to be held to account. I can think of others who started to believe their own propaganda and saw any and every criticism as a personal attack. Such people were disasters waiting to happen; and their problem was that they lost sight of the basics of the Christian life and made themselves accountable to no one. And I am always amazed at the cronies such people manage to gather around themselves: there is always someone willing to stroke the ego of such types, to tell them how wonderful they are whatever shenanigans they get up to; yet a true friend knows the necessity of speaking the truth out of love in all circumstances.”

      And yes I welcome and await the anonymous unposted comments that will flip this to apply to me. Religious addicts are very predictable….

      Luke 6
      26 “Woe to you when all men speak well of you, for their fathers used to treat the false prophets in the same way.”

      • Angelo says:

        You really are something else. You are a prime example of a self-righteous prick.

      • Rory says:

        DM stop being such a naive koolaid drinking jackass, this is how undisclosed s**t is handled in the real world. Crap  you probably gripe about regarding politicians in your living rooms.  Do you suppose when questions begin to arise they (politicians) can all collude to confidentiality agreements while you and I pay their salaries as your friend, pastor and possible riding partner did while all were quietly tossing people under the bus along with years of shenanigans you know nothing about? Or would that be simply ludicrous while unaware stakeholders try to get to the bottom of what took and is taking place in the real world ? No not in the real world…. but in these churches ? Absolutely…

        http://www.cknw.com/2016/04/19/new-coast-realty-owner-steps-aside-company-announces-compliance-measures

  7. Kaz Few says:

    slan·der
    ˈslandər/Submit
    nounLAW
    1.
    the action or crime of making a false spoken statement damaging to a person’s reputation.
    “he is suing the TV network for slander”
    verb
    1.
    make false and damaging statements about (someone).
    “they were accused of slandering the head of state”
    synonyms: defame (someone’s character), blacken someone’s name, tell lies about, speak ill/evil of, sully someone’s reputation, libel, smear, cast aspersions on, spread scandal about, besmirch, tarnish, taint; More

    Just because some christians choose to look away from the truth doesn’t make it slander. Seeking the truth is hardly being lead astray ? Evil in all forms is still evil just as all sin is considered sin no matter what increment the church lays upon it. The call where one is asked to repent is one of love so that the sinner can return to Christ.

  8. Kaz Few says:

    “concerned & confused” & “t-man” ??? really WTF seriously weak man :o(
    The current year is 2016. Trolling anonymously is soooo 2010 LOL

    • Rory says:

      Exactly my point, including spewing garbage impersonated as people I know and see on a nearly weekly basis. I have a growing s#*tload of anonymous imbecilic, my apologies, ignorant, childish name calling from some of these “discipled Christian” religious addicts incapable of engaging in difficult yet simple discussion (who would rather have it all just go away and have new unsuspecting “customers” join their amazing gospel centered, at times coercive churches into another future trainwreck) because they’re doing exactly what Carl Truman talks about quoted above. The impersonator I suspect to be the little man we all know but then again who knows or cares at this point, and well, then there’s “Angelo”….?

  9. Jonah The Prophet of the Most High God says:

    Repent and turn from your path of DESTRUCTION! It’s not too late yet…but it soon WILL BE. The Time is growing short. Tear your clothes and put on Sackcloth and Ashes. Maybe there is still a chance for You. We shall see…the WRATH is coming SOON.

    Jonah

  10. Hi My Name is ______(second from the right), And I’m An Anonymous & Impersonating Religious Addict says:

    When will you live up to your own supposed standards and stop censoring comments on your blog? You are such a hypocrite, I can’t believe I ever trusted you. You have really let me down.

    • Rory says:

      LOL, sooo true Rick
      Locally, #cknwcomments
      #cknwendscomments and so do many news organization as trolls unable to hold an educated discussion fill the Internet and blogs with lackluster and ignorance while “cowardly and anonymously troll comment while dressed in their underpants in their mothers basements” (Drex) unloading parts of their minds they truly couldn’t afford to loose. Hilarious and well put… and so have I to put an end to the trolling anonymous hot air. Anyone who wants can easily find my email within the blog and send your comments there.

      • Rick says:

        You’re such an attention whore. Throw another pity party for yourself and your gang of pathetic whiners. No one cares about all the shit you have to say, it’s all lies. You have a lot to answer for. Give up, go home to mommy and get a life.

      • Rory says:

        Despite your cowardly anonymity I let your comment through “Rick” “Mercer” (second from the right) because you are finally engaging in the discussion….. so please commence with your claims, for legal purposes.

  11. Kaz Few says:

    please please anonymous and bitter pharisees!
    present the truth so that it can be made the topic of discussion instead of a bunch of rants from children

    • Kaz Flew says:

      Kaz Flew over the Cuckoo’s Nest

      • Rory says:

        Hi David Smith, are you out there? Is this actually you while on sabbatical or one of your buddies or former associates flaming peoples names or maybe one of your known Smith counterparts, you know, the ones who gave you all a book like google review then shortly thereafter left you guys in the dust for a more supposedly biblically sound gospel centered church an hour away, now another 1 of 3 “acceptable” or “approved” churches in BC ? Whether it is or not we’ve come to understand through what you all historically call gossip (a term you cadre of pastors wrote the book on and you all know it) from varied sources that big career changes are in the works for you after your “sabbatical”, a career of which you may be better suited to and many would be better “served” having been removed or stepped down. We honestly hope and pray for you to find the true understanding of walking with Christ and genuine ministry void of misguided youthful ambitions, curiously and articulately outlined in Crossways recent Palm Sunday sermon in your absence or removal, in the years to come down this journey of growth and maturity we’re all on.

      • Kaz Few says:

        I am kinda honored that you would suggest that in the realm of Crossway I am the only sane person in a group of lunatics. Randle was a natural leader and knew the power of laughter as well as teamwork. I am flattered you think of me in this way as I thought I made little impact for the decade I served Crossway. Thanks bro !!!
        It’s also possible that as an anonymous troll whose manhood and intelligence would easily be thwarted by a full bottle of ketchup you were probably trying to just make yourself feel less bitter by belittling someone else.I doubt you have read the book nor have the IQ to understand its literary meaning.
        It’s sad that hurling insults and blame shifting is the only thing the supporters (or the men themselves) do to justify what was done or in some cases still being done. It is really horrific that bitterness and spreading hatred has become a spiritual gift in your church.
        Maybe next time be less anonymous and ask a real question or bring that “alternate truth” because trudging through the thick stuff regarding Gods love of His Church is way more fun than your current simpleton rants :o(

 

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